Today's passage in Proverbs (24:15-33) deals with the sluggard or
lazy man. It's not the first time we've seen him and it won't be the last. He
is mentioned 16 times by name throughout Proverbs. We too have plenty of lazy
people in our world today. Welfare has helped many get back on their feet, but
many lazy people have found a resting place in our tax funded welfare system.
We know God's word has much to say about helping the poor and needy. But what does it say
if the person is poor because he is lazy? "If a man shall not work, he
shall not eat" 2 Th.3:10.
If you've been around lazy people, you know how they can come up with all kinds of excuses why they can't go to work. Here's a wild one right out of Proverbs-"The sluggard says, "There is a lion in the road, a fierce lion roaming the streets" Prov.26:13. Again, not all people on welfare are lazy, and certainly not all homeless people are lazy either. But my experiences have led me to believe that a large percentage might be. I've rolled down my car window many times and asked the panhandler with his homeless cardboard sign, "Are you looking for work?" I've always gotten the same answer, "Oh yeah!" So I've given them a card with my name and number on it and asked them to call me. Almost none ever have. One guy did and I lined up a job for him at a thrift store a friend managed. He quit after the first day. A young homeless guy I met years ago took me up on my offer and I generously paid him to help out with simple paperwork and cleaning at our first church building on 44th and Paulina. The next time I just paid him minimum wage. He was angry and said he could make more panhandling on a Friday evening. That was the last I ever saw of him.
If you've been around lazy people, you know how they can come up with all kinds of excuses why they can't go to work. Here's a wild one right out of Proverbs-"The sluggard says, "There is a lion in the road, a fierce lion roaming the streets" Prov.26:13. Again, not all people on welfare are lazy, and certainly not all homeless people are lazy either. But my experiences have led me to believe that a large percentage might be. I've rolled down my car window many times and asked the panhandler with his homeless cardboard sign, "Are you looking for work?" I've always gotten the same answer, "Oh yeah!" So I've given them a card with my name and number on it and asked them to call me. Almost none ever have. One guy did and I lined up a job for him at a thrift store a friend managed. He quit after the first day. A young homeless guy I met years ago took me up on my offer and I generously paid him to help out with simple paperwork and cleaning at our first church building on 44th and Paulina. The next time I just paid him minimum wage. He was angry and said he could make more panhandling on a Friday evening. That was the last I ever saw of him.
I don't think I am a calloused soul. I've given to a
Christian relief agency for decades, but I don't give money to those panhandling.
Wait a minute; hold your fire. I too know the passages about giving to those who ask of you. But those must be balanced with God's word on not giving to
people unwilling to work. What do you say to the person who says he wants the
money for food? I've offered to take such men for a meal. Very few have
accepted. Perhaps they had other plans for the money. It's refreshing when a
panhandler is gut honest with you.
Here are a few other experiences I've had regarding homeless panhandlers. When I came to Humboldt Park in Chicago, I had to step over
the winos passed out in front of the liquor store just to get into the youth
center. When they were awake and asked for money, I didn't give to them because
I didn't want to further their ruin. While living there, I took in a homeless
guy in his early twenties named Frank. He disappeared after a couple of weeks.
Nothing was missing except my brand new bike which he loaned out to a teenager,
who loaned it out to some gang-banger friends. (Never did get that bike back,
but that's a different story.)
When I came to serve at New Life in 1988,
I encountered more homeless people panhandling. I decided I would try it...sort of.
I dressed up nicely and wrote on a white board, "Not Homeless, Not Hungry,
Not Broke- May I give you a quarter?" I had a great time, but the panhandlers
did not like me invading their turf. For them I was "bad for
business." Once my family and I saw two homeless men after their
panhandling shift was over. One took out the pennies he had been given and
threw them to the ground. Another time I served in a homeless shelter. It was a
winter night and the Super Bowl was on. I was shocked when a few of the men
left the facility. I guess they got what they wanted and had some better place
to go. News investigation teams have followed "homeless" people to their
homes. Is that to say that all homeless people are frauds? Of course not. One
homeless man I repeatedly talked to named, Mark* told me he was a former heroin
addict. He was a prodigal who had forsaken his family after ripping them off.
He also had turned away from the Lord. Sin had reduced him to the streets. He
was the one who told me about the other panhandlers working the same corner.
"That hunched-over woman is a crack head and is horrible to her daughter.
Don't give her a dime." I didn't. As a matter of fact, I never give money
anymore to panhandlers. Why? Here a few additional reasons.
-I don't want to contribute to an
addiction if that is a problem they are having.
-Homeless shelters can best help such
people. Leaders of such have said on Christian radio, not to give to
panhandlers. If you want to help them, give to those shelters who can evaluate
the person's genuine needs. If they are not lazy, they can best help them.
-Giving to able bodied panhandlers just
encourages them to keep panhandling. If no one gave them anything, they would
be forced to work to get food. "If a man shall not work, he shall not eat."
Then where should the homeless turn to for
help? Homeless shelters. Or perhaps they should go back home and make things
right, if they did their family wrong. The family is supposed to be a safety
net to those truly in need and unable to work. "If anyone does not provide
for his relatives, and especially his immediate family, he has denied the faith
and is worse than an unbeliever" 1 Tim.5:8. I know not all
unbelievers take care of their families, but it's not my job to enable an able
bodied man to live such a lowly life. He needs to come to his senses and go
back home. When the prodigal was reduced to nothing, he came to his senses and
went back home. It is not the job of the church either to feed lazy people,
though a number of suburban churches drive in on a Saturday morning to feed the
homeless. I'm sure it makes them feel good. But if they are not understanding
each person's situation, they just may be enabling bad behavior. How much
longer would the prodigal son have remained far from his father and in his sin if he was provided
food and clothing?
I've seen healthy young men, start to bow
their heads and shuffle when they take their place on the street corners to beg.
What a horrible thing to do to one's mind, to play the part of a victim. If
life kicks you down, get up. Men need to be treated as men. "You are
better than this! You can make a better life for yourself than this." As
with the prodigal son, moral poverty leads to much financial poverty. At least
he was willing to work to feed pigs.
But what if the panhandler is not lazy but
is injured, mentally unstable or just can't find work? Those are good
questions. But most of us don't have the time to carefully investigate the background
of the panhandler, but a homeless shelter can. Recommend they go to one. (My 16 year old son is working this summer at a great one called, A Safe Haven- 2750 W. Roosevelt Rd.) Sadly,
I've talked with homeless people who told me they didn’t want to go to a
shelter. They didn't like the requirements and curfew. Sounds like teenage
rebellion, which has just continued into adulthood. To such people I don't feel
badly for not giving to them.
Having said all this, I do give to people
on the street corners raising money for legitimate organizations. And I did
give to one panhandler more recently. He was sitting down, smiling with a
T-shirt that read, "Billionaire in Training." I gave him a quarter
just for making me laugh!:)
1.- Our compassion for people must be combined with wisdom. If you've had a good or bad experience with a homeless person, please share that. Or if you think I've taken a heartless or a helpful view toward the homeless, please feel free to share that too.
*Mark got help from a few different Christians. He got off the streets and last I knew was starting back to church. I told him he needed to make things right with his parents too. I trust he has.
2.- Pick a verse from our passage in Proverbs 24:15-33 and write it out and some of your thoughts about it. Then look for opportunities to share it with others.
Thanks for the encouragement you give to your brothers on the blog and texts. Thanks also for remembering to put your points on the board as soon as you're done writing here on the blog. It saves us from having to make reminder calls.
Announcements
Happy Birthday James! Enjoy the the day!
This is the week for birthdays. We will be wishing birthday greetings to a few other M3 brothers this week also. Bring out the cake!
Announcements
Happy Birthday James! Enjoy the the day!
This is the week for birthdays. We will be wishing birthday greetings to a few other M3 brothers this week also. Bring out the cake!
1. I have had 3 encounters with panhandlers. The 1st was a homeless man and I pulled over to him. I asked if he was looking for work-- I gave him my business card and money to call--never called. 2nd was a another homeless man with the exact situation and result. My opinion is similar to Dave's. But 1 last time I was walking and saw a guy in need as he was homeless with no coat and it was about 29 degrees. I asked if I could give him my cost and he asked why I wanted to help him as he was not begging. I said that he needed it more than I did-- and he took the gift. I then proceeded to ask him what happened to him and he said he was mentally slow and his girlfriend betrayed him with another man and then kicked him out. His family was far away so he didn't know where to go. I asked if he wanted janitor work at my company and he jumped up and said today. I took him to the job site and put him to work and he performed very well so I promoted him to production and he became a long time employee. He was loyal and hard working. I think this was rare but we as Christians need to delve into the lives of less fortunate as we attempt to save the lost souls.
ReplyDelete2.."fear the Lord and King , my son , and do not join the rebellious officials; for those 2 will send sudden destruction on them, and who knows what calamities they can bring on them."
Proverbs 24:21-22
Follow God only and no other ruler nor rules and promote his ruled of righteousness and you will not be forsaken
Jack that is a wonderful story! You saw a person in need who wasn't even begging, gave up your coat, found out about his situation ans then offered him a job. So glad to hear the way he worked and thus, things worked out well for him. He was not a sluggard.
DeleteBrother Jack, you have a heart of gold!!!! God bless you :-)
DeleteGreat way to engage Jack. It was important to ask what they need and too see what they need. You were a blessing to all three, only one took it.
DeleteThat was very generous of you, Jack! :)
DeleteJack you are such a caring person.
DeleteYour a great man Jack!
Delete1. I also tend to agree with Dave's view. We never give any money to them but on very few occasions we have given them some food. Actually we carry a couple of gift cards in our car with a couple dollars on them from a fast food restaurant, so if we see that they really are hungry we will give them a card so they can get a meal. But other than that we give to organizations like Compassion and Operation Christmas Child which help out children in need and present them with the Gospel.
ReplyDelete2. Prov. 24:19-20 "Fret not yourself because of evildoers, and be not envious of the wicked, for the evil man has not future; the lamp of the wicked will be put out."
I think this is great verse because it helps us keep everything in our life in perspective, it could be easy at times to be envious when the eveldoer prospers but we are to to the opposite. We are to put our eyes on God and follow Him knowing that everything material in this world is just temporary and only God can provide something that will last forever- Eternal Life.
That is a wise way of responding Roger. Very good!
DeleteBrother Roger, you have the gift of generosity! Bless your heart :-)
Delete1. I would always see this guy sitting in front of Walgreen's with a dog begging for money. One time the Walgreen's employees told him to leave. He got up and walked to his SUV and drove off. I couldn't believe it. That changed my whole aspect about homeless people. I no longer give money but if I have water or food with me I would give them that.
ReplyDelete2. Proverbs 24.29.ESV Do not say, “I will do to him as he has done to me; I will pay the man back for what he has done.” This verse shows us that we should just turn our cheeks away from revenage. We should know that God's the one who will judge that person for his acts.
Thanks Dave for wishing happy birthday!
"Oooh!" I said out loud as I read your story of the man driving away in the SUV. Amazing!
DeleteHey, enjoy the day James!
You know James I forget their are people like that. Thanks for reminding me.
DeleteHappy Birthday James!
DeleteBlessings on the occasion of your birthday, brother James. I take issue with people using dogs to panhandle. I question how well the poor animal is cared for, and whether they are just being used to solicit my sympathy. When my wife and I do give a little more to such people, we make it clear that at least half of what we are giving should go to the care of dog. Some people are simply shameless.
DeleteHappy Birthday brother :-) , wishing all the best the Lord has in store for you!! "When they hurled their insults at him (Jesus), he did not retaliate; when he suffered, he made no threats. Instead, he entrusted himself to him who judges justly." 1 Peter 2:23
DeleteHappy birthday bro! God bless.
DeleteThanks guys for making me feel loved
DeleteHappy Birthday, James! God Bless!
DeleteBrother James, That's because you are ;-)
DeleteHappy Bday bro.
DeleteHappy birthday James hope you have a great one.
DeleteIt's sneaky people that give a bad name to those in need.
DeleteHappy birthday, James
I totally understand your perspective there.
DeleteHappy Birthday James. God bless you bro.
Proverbs 24;17Do not gloat when your enemy falls; when he stumbles, do not let your heart rejoice,24;18 or the LORD will see and disapprove and turn his wrath away from him...These verses make me nervous because some times I do feel vindicated when calamity strikes them. I haven't gloat in years..... The people who hang out by the liquor store by my house I grew up with them, all they wanted to do was party, now they sit by the liquor getting liquor for under age kids so they can get a bottle for them selves
ReplyDeleteSo glad you are not with them Flo. You are not a sluggard, but a faithful worker.
DeleteThanks Dave. I think GOD has more for my life than drugs or liquor
DeleteGlad you chose the right path bro. May God continue to pour knowledge and understanding in to your life. God bless you!
DeleteVery happy that you have chosen to follow the path of righteousness instead.
DeleteGood choice. Keep your sight on the Lord.
DeleteWhen I had my H2 I seen this guy at the light begging for money, I was 4 or 5 cars back when I rolled down my window he took off for my truck like I was passing out hundreds dollars bills, passing up other people trying to give him money, I only gave him a dollar the light changed and the other cars left with out giving him anything.....Greed he got a dollar and lost about 10 dollars
ReplyDeleteBrother Florencio, he assumed "big truck, deep pockets". I'm glad you chose the better path in Jesus :-)
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ReplyDelete1. I have had a number of encounters with homeless people. I volunteer at breakthrough ministry in east garfield park. But having worked downtown for a number of years, you see your fair share of homeless people. I know I have had a conversation with Dave around this topic before. I always have struggled with giving and not giving. If I give I try to talk to them more, have a conversation, ask to pray with them. I do ask to see if I can connect them to a shelter. I have offered to take a few homeless men for a meal, only to be cursed out. But there have been some where I built a relationship with, knew their names, shared their stories, would just sit with them during my lunch hours. I was able to share Jesus with them and give them a bible. I did buy them food often and give them backpacks with toiletries and blankets, things they asked for. Yes I don't want to encourage people to continue to stay on the street, but I do want to help and love them.
ReplyDelete2. Prov. 24:27 Finish your outdoor work and get your fields ready;after that, build your house.
This is something I have been taught and like to share with other young men. The principle here is to make sure you have your financial and vocational life together before you undertake building a family, marriage, or getting a house literally. Make sure your able to lead yourself spiritually, financially, and vocationally, before you try to lead a women.
Brother Eddie, "The principle here is to make sure you have your financial and vocational life together before you undertake building a family, marriage, or getting a house literally. Make sure your able to lead yourself spiritually, financially, and vocationally, before you try to lead a women." Love it :-)!!!!!!
DeleteSo appreciate your care and willingness to help.
Deleteits awesome to see all the people you are reaching out to. You are a powerful weapon for God. God bless you bro!
DeleteYou have such a caring heart. May God continue to bless you
DeleteThat's a very good attitude to have toward them, Eddie. Not to mention that it is also very generous. :)
DeleteThose are very good thoughts regarding the proverb.
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ReplyDelete1 I also don't give to beggars for the same reasons you mentioned. I think we talked about this all many years ago at one of our monthly meetings at your house and I have come to agree with your reasons. A year or so before we had that discussion I gave some coins to a beggar near my university; After I gave him the coins he asked me "Don't you have any bills?" I told him "yes I do and collected the coins back from him as if I was going to swap the coins for a few bills, then I walked away with all my money.
ReplyDeletePart of my job at my school is to manage service projects. Every year my school goes to another part of the world to do volunteer work. Last year I took a group of grade 10 students to a small village outside of Hanoi. We were supposed to help a local school in some unspecified way. When we showed up the school leaders didn't really have any plan for us to do anything but asked us to prepare a garden, which we were all excited to help out with. The students and I started digging up bricks from the area where the garden would be and hacking up huge weeds. I kept wondering though why a bunch of rich kids from a private school in Singapore were tasked with this, in a village full of farmers and their kids who never got around to this. The next day I asked the school leaders what they were planning to plant in the garden. Their response let me know they were not going to plant anything; they didn't really know what to give us to work on and this was just a means of wasting our time (this is typical of communist and post-communist cultures).
It has really made me aware of the dangers of volun-tourism. The worst thing of all is that my students left feeling like they made a difference. Its the same problem when groups go to places like Cambodia and teach English for 1 week. Their heart is in the right place, but they usually end up teaching "heads, shoulders, knees and toes", which those kids have heard every week with each new cycle of volun-tourists; usually they play along though to be polite.
I am not always a fan of the Noble Peace Prize committee's choice of recipients, but I remember reading recently about a prize winner from Bangladesh, who gives micro loans to women to start small businesses. These were often of $200 or less and allowed women to buy a sewing machine etc... I really like this idea since it enables the poor to pull themselves out of poverty through hard work and determination. (the interest on the loans was very low).
http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2006/10/061013-nobel-peace.html
2 Verse 29 stands out to me and reminds me of Romans 12:19 Do not take revenge, my dear friends, but leave room for God's wrath, for it is written: "It is mine to avenge; I will repay," says the Lord.
Brother Ed, you've given me a whole new perspective on foreign affairs. Thank you, God bless :-)
DeleteMicro loans are a great idea Ed and I want to get involved with them. I believe there are some good Christian organizations helping in this way as well that we could partner with.
DeleteVery good and interesting thoughts on volun-tourism. I will have to agree with what you say.
Delete1. During my backsliden days, while driving I came to a red light and I was approached by a lady asking for 3 dollars for a "burger". I was amused at the exact amount she requested so I reached into my cup holder that doubles as a change cup and grabbed practically all I had in there. As I reached out the window and poured into her hands, she starred at it and her continence dramatically changed. She'd become angry that I hadn't complied with her request for 3 dollars and threw all the change in my face.
ReplyDeleteI became angry that my gesture of good faith had been met with an assault. "No good deed goes unpunished" (Author Unknown to me). I grabbed what I could from my lap and tossed it out the window onto the road and told her that if she wanted it she'd have to pick it up herself and drove off.
Since then, I seldom give any panhandler change. I've purchased food for them at times and I carry water and miscellaneous snacks on hand to give them, at least I've done something to help.
2. "A little sleep, a little slumber, a little folding of the hands to rest— and poverty will come on you like a thief and scarcity like an armed man." Proverbs 24:33-34 As I've shared before, I don't like lazy!
Ugh, another disappointing experience in trying to help, yet you have not harden your heart Robert. Very good!
DeleteRobert , can't imagine you losing your temper. Now there is a new man of God.
DeleteDeuteronomy 15:7 "If there is a poor man with you, one of your brothers, in any of your towns in your land which the Lord your God is giving you, you shall not harden your heart, nor close your hand from your poor brother." (New American Standard Bible). Matthew 6:3 "But when you give to the needy, do not let your left hand know what your right hand is doing." These are the two verses that form my philosophy on giving. That is not to say that I haven't been guilty of rationalizing my decisons to give from time to time, but I generally don't give it a second thought because in most cases, only God knows the true need of those I give to. If in fact they choose to use my meager help to feed a vice or they are simply lazy, God will judge them accordingly. The Lord calls me to give, to not harden my heart, and not to rationalize my purpose for giving. What I do struggle with is the guilt I sometimes feel when I am unable to give or when I feel that what I give is not enough. I often fantasize that were I very wealthy (financially) I would do so much more to get my brothers and sisters off the street, but I have to agree with Dave that some people just don't want to learn how to fish and are content with others fishing for them.
ReplyDeleteProverbs 24:17 "Do not gloat when your enemy falls; when they stumble,mdo not let your heart rejoice, 18 or the Lord will see and disapprove and turn his wrath away from them." Too many times I have been guilty of exactly what this Proverb warns against. I tend to be a pretty tolerant guy, patient and disciplined enough to steer from trouble, but when someone pushes me to the edge, I lash out and become a completely different person. Wrath overtakes me and I come close to losing all restraint (especially when I see evil being done to the helpless or those I love). I must do a better job of reminding myself that I do not fight these battles alone. Deuteronomy 31:3 reminds us that "The Lord your God himself will cross over ahead of you. He will destroy these nations before you..." It is not my place to be judge, jury, and executioner in the heat of passion. Better to calm my anger and steer clear of wrath, for those who live by the sword die by it. The Lord goes before me and delivers His justice so that my heart would never harbor anger or vengeance. God calls us to love our enemies. He will see to their judgement and spare us of the sin our anger would lead us into.
Brother Osiris, you reminded me of the story of King David being spared from shedding blood by Abigail, Nabal's wife when David was on route to kill him and his entire household in 1 Samuel 25.
DeleteYou have a very kind heart and desire to help all Osiris. I believe our biblical philosophy needs to take in other Scriptures as well, such as "If a man shall not work, he shall not eat." As you mentioned, some people just want to be given a fish. They have a sluggard's mindset. I believe giving to those who could work is actually hurting them, not helping them. God wants us to love with wisdom and discernment- Phil.1:9-10. I know that takes more time, but that's my take. May God's truth and love continue to guide us. It's good to stretch our thinking. I certainly respect those who differ with me on this controversial issue. Best of blessings!
Delete1) I give to panhandlers here and there. I give out New Life cards to them as well, but I do not see them visiting. I have to say it is one way of teaching my children to give.I now understand that I am encouraging the behavior. I will seek to find the organizations that can better attend to their needs.
ReplyDelete2) Proverbs 24:16b the righteous fall seven times, they rise again, but the wicked stumble when calamity strikes.
I pray as men of God that we get back up when disaster strikes and help the brother in need.
Brother Sammy, as the Lord leads you. I'm convinced your heart is in the right place :-)
DeleteGood outreach Sam from your good heart.
DeleteGood to have brothers who are there help you back on your feet. Bless you Sam
DeleteSam, I like the idea of giving out New Life cards, I'll have to pick some up Sunday.
Delete1.In my humble opinion there are many different kinds of homeless people. Most have more agency than most of us think. We won't be their savior.
ReplyDelete2.First plant your fields; then build your barn. (Proverbs 24:27 MSG)
Brother Dave D, amen! "The poor you will always have with you, but you will not always have me (Jesus)." Matthew 26:11
DeleteYou are right Dave, there are several types of homeless people. We mentioned a few today such as the sluggard, those who are homeless because they have been reduced to poverty due to addictions, those who are mentally deranged and those who are truly willing to work. It does take time and wisdom to give as scripture would have us. If a man shall not work he shall not eat. We need to determine who is who.
DeleteThis was a good topic Always had questions on this.
Delete
ReplyDelete1.- I do not have a sure fire system on giving to the homeless, panhandlers. I do have reservations at times, that I'm not contributing to any of their addictions, I am selective on who I do give money to and sometimes I question if I was taken in. On occasions if they ask money for food I actually go to nearest fast food for a meal and bring it back or sometimes I take them there to purchase a meal for them. Their is a man that I see in this parking lot directly south of Currie HS that I always give money to. He's hunch over and he reminds me of my moms adopted brother. I can only hope that what I give them is actually assisting them? I can truly say that it's becoming harder now to give money because there are so many now out there. I believe that it's a testament to our present world deterioration. Their are many people and families out their who are one step to being homeless. It's scary!
2.- Prov. 24:32 "I applied my heart to what I observe and learned a lesson from what I saw;"
Today's topic to me has some reverence to this verse, that I have compassion on my fellow man out there in need and do not let my doubts dictate any way or means that this money given may make a little difference for them.
Yes Armando the deterioration of our society contributes much to the homeless situation. As it's been said, moral poverty leads to financial poverty. And our country is swimming in moral poverty.
DeleteBrother Armando, Pastor Chuck Swindoll has a wonderful series on"Erosion". I highly recommend it :-). Great insight brother!
Delete1) I've never really had a bad experience but I did offer a few to work for
ReplyDeleteMe when I had my landscape business, they never showed.
2) Do not say, “I’ll do to them as they have done to me; I’ll pay them back for what they did.” (Proverbs 24:29 NIV)
Brother Rich, your heart was in the right place. Their loss, unfortunately! Great communicating via text with you earlier. God bless you :-)
DeleteUgh! Ditto Robert's good words.
Delete1. I've had good and bad experiences .One bad one was a guy in his late twentys. He had look of disbelief that I had handed him change.
ReplyDelete2. I passed by a field of a sluggard by the vineyard of a man lacking sense, and behold, it was all overgrown with thorns . The ground was covered with nettles, and it's stone wall was broken down. Then I saw and considered it; I looked and received instruction , a little sleep , a little slumber, a little of the hands to rest and the property will come upon you like a robber and want like an armed man.
Laziness can effect our spiritual life. When we put down the word. When we stop associating with our Godly brothers. When we sit back and say "not today", it become easier each time and the evil one comes into the picture. Our spiritual defense ( the wall) is down. And sin takes over (thorns and nettles).
Excellent analogy Louie!
DeleteBrother Louie, absolutely right, Hebrews 10:25 ;-)
DeleteGood job Lou
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ReplyDelete1) I've encountered many panhandlers and other people asking for money. There really has not been stand out moments, but I have noticed that many panhandlers and other people asking for money are very pushy to me. I have no idea why. Anyway, I will give people who are hungry my protein or granola bars if I have them with me at the time, and I will give people some change if I feel more compelled to give to them. However, I try to be cautious as I don't want to give it to a person who will spend it on alcohol and other bad habits.
ReplyDelete2) Proverbs 24:29 "Do not say, “I’ll do to them as they have done to me; I’ll pay them back for what they did.”"
God is our avenger. As a result, we really have no place seeking revenge.
Brother Alex, I know it's sincere when a man gives away their protein fix. Bless your heart my brother :-)
Deletevery good Alex! Robert's beating me to all the good lines. :)
DeleteThat's a good thing to do Alex, carry some extra snacks with you. At times I given away my snack bars or fruit that i have on me.
DeleteI like how you worded this Alex - God is our avenger. As a result, we really have no place seeking revenge.
Delete1- Every now and them I may give a dollar to someone asking for it. They way I see it is that the Lord has blessed me. I'm probably going to use that dollar for something I don't need anyways. Also if that person is being dishonest about what they say they need it for, then the way i see it, the Lord will judge them. All I'm trying to do is be helpful even if that person isn't being completely honest.
ReplyDeleteBut one story that really stands out to me about helping a homeless person. I was on my way home one night from the north side. I was about to get on the train when i saw two guys in their mid 20's sitting on the curb with their dog. I approached them and we began to talk. One of them was friendly while the other one walked away, I think he was annoyed at me. The guy opened up to me that he and his buddy had left home and where traveling through different states. They were looking for a new place to live but in their travels they were homeless. I asked the guy "hey you want to take a walk with me to this taco place?" He agreed to walk with me.When I ordered I looked at him and said "ok, what do you want to eat?" He replied with "I have no money to eat, all the money we make we save for the next town and also to feed our dog". I told the guy that i knew he didn't have money and the reason I asked him to walk with me was because I wanted to buy him a meal. He was shy at first and wanted to order just a taco. I insisted that he get a full meal because i wanted to pay for it. I could tell that he was being genuine, he never asked me for money but rather through our conversation I felt I wanted to bless him. Before I left, I asked him to take down my phone number so that if he ever came back through Chicago and or decided to stay here to contact me.
2- Proverbs 24:17-18
17 Do not gloat when your enemy falls;
when they stumble, do not let your heart rejoice,
18 or the Lord will see and disapprove
and turn his wrath away from them. -NIV
Brother Luis, as long as I've known you, you have always shown compassion and were sympathetic. Wonderful qualities that are inshort in quantities these days. God bless you :-)
DeleteThat was very kind of you Luis. you have a caring heart.
Delete1. Currently I’m having problems with the panhandlers that as for money on 79th and Cicero and 87th and Cicero. Those young kids have been a problem for some time. See, they ask for money because they say they are homeless and hungry. They work in a group of about 15 that station themselves on different corners. They use the change machine at Jewel to exchange their coins. Every so often they will show up in front of my house to buy drugs on the fly. See I live by a dead end street. A few cars will pull up and people on bike will show up and also these panhandlers. A car will show up and distribute drugs to all of them and in a flash they all disappear. I have video-taped this many times and have reported it to the police and my Alderman. I just had a meeting with my Alderman about this situation two weeks ago to see what can be done. I refuse to give any money to them and currently we are working to put signs up that will not allow and panhandling on these corners. I don’t have a problem helping where help is needed but not to contribute in your addiction. The police have done nothing but give me a case number with no follow ups. My neighbors need to get involved but most just keep to themselves.
ReplyDelete2. Proverbs 24: 29 NIV "Do not say, "I'll do to them as they have done to me; I'll pay them back for what they did." I have battled with this many times. People that have done me harm at one time I would bring hurt into their life as they did to me. Recently I hired a plumber to redo my entire house and he never showed up again after demoing. After a little work I received his home information and was ready to get my money back. Instead I sent him a pic of his house with a message to make himself right. Well he was not happy. My wife talked to me and said that God will handle it. I left it alone, but inside of me I was ready to explode. Time is what calmed me down. I still think about it but now I wonder what if he needed the money more than me. What if? Well I place it in God’s hand only because my wife talked me out of it. God bless her.
Ugh! You also have seen first hand, panhandlers whom we ought not give to.
DeleteTo your second point Horacio- I agree that revenge is not appropriate, but I don't think being a Christian means we cannot seek legal recourse, if necessary. We will bring appropriate discipline to bear on children to do as they ought. Some men still act very childish and need to have appropriate pressure brought on them or they will continue to hurt others.
Horacio, you have a wise wife. I'm happy she kept you out of trouble.
Delete1) I do have a big problem some days I can give and some days I can not. I go by what I feel that day. I learned you can not always give and give, it is sad to say that not everyone has a true heart. I do not want to be the reason someone keeps up with an addiction.
ReplyDeleteGood words Andre- "I do not want to be the reason someone keeps up with an addiction."
DeleteWe need to learn enough about the person to know what would best help him.
1. I have offered meals to and rides but most reject and prefer cash. Although I was once at a week-long conference. One night a few of us went to this nice place to eat. I took the leftovers because it seem like too much to leave. I remember asking myself what I was going to do with it. I was going to a hotel that did not have a frig in the room and I wasn't going to eat it. As we walked back, a young homeless man asked me if I would be willing to give it to him. I was surprised. I told him it was my leftovers. He said he didn't care because he was hungry, so I gave it to him. He opened it like a Christmas gift. He was so excited to what it was and how much was in the box. He tapped his friend on the shoulder and with a big smile said “look what I got for us." You'd thought I bought them both steak dinners. Felt good.
ReplyDelete2. Proverbs 24:17 Do not rejoice when your enemy falls, and do not let your heart be glad when he stumbles. This can be difficult because we can feel a sense of joy that righteousness has prevailed and God's word was proven to true. Not to mention, he had it coming. But when I remember my old life; I say, there but by the grace of God walk I. Then I feel sorry for them, but still kind of good. Oh that battle between spirit and flesh.
Well written story Rick!
DeleteRegarding point 2- I also think it's appropriate to feel "a sense of joy that righteousness has prevailed and God's word has proven true" Lord, just help us not to rejoice in someone's downfall.
Rick, God must have been telling you to take the leftovers, He had plans for them.
Delete1. Sadly more negative experiences than good. Once we were handing out sandwiches downtown with a ministry at church and a lady gave it back. " I don't want your sandwich I want ribs! Another time a guys literally took dollar bills out of my hand. As a moody student you couldn't leave campus without being hit up several times in a short walk. It kind of annoyed and jaded me.
ReplyDeleteBut a positive experience I had was with the bread of life ministry at new life Bridgeport years ago. I used to teach once a month for awhile. The lady who ran it was formerly homeless and and an addict and had compassion for them. I was able to build relationships with guys. They gave out bus cards, soup, and the gospel. Many of the men were Vietnam vets and told me they saw horrendous things in war and were despised when they came home. One guy told me he likes to drink and likes the freedom of answering to no one. Free from society. Many of these men later got sick and died. They drowned their sorrows into a bottle.
Dave I pretty much agree with you but you must be led by the Spirit and its a case by case thing. But I do not typically give panhandlers money anymore.
2. I passed by the field of the sluggard And by the vineyard of the man lacking sense, And behold, it was completely overgrown with thistles; Its surface was covered with nettles, And its stone wall was broken down. When I saw, I reflected upon it; I looked, and received instruction. "A little sleep, a little slumber, A little folding of the hands to rest," Then your poverty will come as a robber And your want like an armed man. (Proverbs 24:30-34 NASB)
Your a good man for trying brother nic ;)
DeleteI echo Phil's words Nic. I would add the following words from a counselor's perspective. If a man came to me and told me the reason he was on the streets was because he saw horrible things in Viet Nam, I would empathize with him, but then I would still call him to act responsibly. We emasculate men when we let them believe and act as victims. Look at the vets who have lost limbs and yet are overcoming in life. I am not trying to be heartless. I just know that we hurt people by not calling them to manly behavior, whether they be Christian or non-Christian. We can never help someone who won't do their part.
Delete1. I drive past people with homeless signs daily. I can relate to them in a sense because i used to ask people for money back when i was using drugs, just never held a sign. I have a couple old using buddies that stand out there with signs and as soon as they get enough money they jump on the bus and head to the westside to get there dope. If people come up to my car usually i will give them a dollar with a Narcotics Anonymous card and tell them that i used to be out there hustling to and i found a way out of that life and call me if they would like to go to a meeting with me. Usually they never call but one time i did see this girl come into a NA meeting because of the card that i gave her and she remembered me and thanked me.
ReplyDelete2. Proverbs 24:16 For though the righteous fall seven times, they rise again, but the wicked stumble when calamity strikes.
That's great Philip to hear how God is redeeming your past life and using it to reach out those that are trapped so far from Him.
DeleteYou have an insider's perspective Phil! Thanks for inviting people to make needed changes. Very good!
DeletePhil, it's great to hear how you helped change someone's life.
DeleteGreat, unique perspective Phil! Well done with the girl too brother!
DeleteGreat job reaching out Phil
Delete1) During our vacation, on our way to California, we were going through a small town on historic Route 66. I forgot the reason why we pulled into a rundown parking lot by a closed up store. It was lightly raining. We saw a homeless man laying on the ground with a blanket by the doors where he was out of the rain. We had some left over bread and sandwich meat with us. I got out of the car with it to offer it to him. He saw me but just rolled over leaving his back toward me. Suddenly a large dog that I didn't know was there lunged out toward me barking and growling viciously. Thank you Lord that it was tied to a leash and could only go so far. The dog must have been protecting it's master. I left the bag just out of reach of the dog with a bottle of water hoping they would use it and we continued on our journey.
ReplyDelete2) Proverbs 24:26 An honest answer is like a kiss on the lips.
An honest answer is like a kiss especially when the honest person really cares for you and doesn't want you to make a mistake or become embarrassed or to fail at something your overconfident in doing.
Welcome back Dave! I think Phil.1:9-10 is such an important truth that our love needs to be guided by insight and discernment. That takes more time than most of us have in on the spot encounters. That's my take on such.
Delete1- I've helped homeless people before. I once tried to help a guy, he said he wanted coffee. So I told him I will go take him for coffee, but he said he can go get it himself just give him the money. Once I told him again i'll take him he said forget it. I guess it is what it is.
ReplyDelete2- Proverbs 24:21New Living Translation (NLT)
21 My child, fear the Lord and the king.
Don’t associate with rebels,
Ugh! Live and learn and discern- Phil.1:9-10.
Delete1
ReplyDeleteI believe this was said very rightly that balance is the pivotal key in discerning who to give and donate time time to. There is always someone that is on the expressway exit that is see on the way to and from work. I discovered early on that a person is likely to be won over by food and giving of a meal. But recently though i was convicted to take the good measure a step further and ensure i pass the individual whatever i might have in my car that will talk about jesus.
2
Verse 24:17 reminded me of our placement as representatives of Christ. While victory is guaranteed for His people being us and we know that we are in the image of Christ we do not demean or look down on the obstacles that were already conquered; the greatest show of a man's life for Christ is how he loves his enemies and shows Christ Crucified to them.
Yes Gary, I believe that discernment is what is key in knowing who to give and donate time to. We are not to help sluggards, but those that want to improve themselves. Offering Jesus is the greatest gift you could offer anyone. Very good!
Delete1. Dave G, I do not think you have taken a heartless position on some of your comments in the blog at all. I think you brought up great stories and real life experiences and I love what you wrote "But most of us don't have the time to carefully investigate the background of the panhandler, but a homeless shelter can. Recommend they go to one. (A Safe Haven- 2750 W. Roosevelt Rd.)". I personally try to give with a message "In Jesus Name" or with an invitation to a New Life service.
ReplyDeleteOnce I told a homeless gentleman, I do not have much here, but I give this change to you in the Name of Christ Jesus the Lord and he looked right at me and said "Yeah,.... right" and snickered :( It is funny in hindsight, but it was Not funny at the time when he said it. Honestly, I have struggled with "giving or not to give" to panhandlers, because I just do not know their specific situation that has led them there. I actually have a "coin change" bucket in my car that I have labeled "Homeless money" and I always give out change from there. I may just change my approach and give this coin change bucket to an organization, like " A Safe Haven" you mentioned???
2. Prov 24:30 says "Do not say, “I’ll do to them as they have done to me; I’ll pay them back for what they did.” - Please do not get revenge my brothers. Leave that to God, for He says in Hebrews 10:30 "For we know Him who said, “It is mine to avenge; I will repay,” and again, “The Lord will judge his people.”
Very good Israel! I use the change I keep in my car to give to people on the street raising money for legitimate organizations And yes, David is working at A Safe Haven. Very nice accommodations and programs to help get people back on their feet.
DeleteI learned about giving in Jesus name from you :) Serves as a great reminder Tio. Thanks!
Delete1. I helped this one guy named Randal and another named Dan that came out of the Pacific garden mission.they both return to their weakness which was alcohol. Randal smashed my motorcycle up and broke his arm. Dan smash my fire truck up and was thrown back into jail. Both men were very talented but couldn't stay off the sauce.
ReplyDeletePro.24.17-18."Do not gloat when your enemy falls; when they stumble, do not let your heart rejoice, or the Lord will see and disapprove and turn his wrath away from them."
We are supposed to pray for our enemies.
sorry to hear that George
DeleteI don't have to many good or bad experiences. Often I find myself looking the other way at times when I encounter with them. I know I've given fruit ( I always carry fruit). Some have said with a sincere yes and others have said" I don't need your fruit. I need frrom.
ReplyDeleteFirst plant your fields; then build your barn. Proverbs 24:27 MSG. AHHH so much meaning here.
That's a great idea Ish! I am going to need to bring some fruit around with me more often!
Delete1 – I started working in the Loop a couple years ago and noticed a lot of beggars asking for money. I didn’t trust that money given to them wouldn’t go toward alcohol or drugs so to easy my conscious I started giving monthly to the Pacific Garden Mission (www.pgm.org). I still will run into 7-11 to buy a sandwich for someone from time to time but I usually don’t give money.
ReplyDeleteThere are two interactions that really stick out in my mind. One night I was out walking around Oak Park I met a man who started talking and walking with me. He told me where he hung out in the day and how he was scared sleeping in the park at night. At one point he stopped and prayed for me then a few minutes later he asked for some money so he could get a place to stay. As we parted I gave him a few dollars but I remember him asking for more. I don’t think I gave him anymore but I remember wondering on my way home if he was telling the truth.
The other interaction was a few weeks ago when I got off the train there was a woman and her 5 or 6 year old son who were asking for money. I didn’t give them any but I picked up some fruit and a package of cookies for the little boy. He seemed excited when I handed it to them. I saw them a few times over the next week and gave them a couple dollars but haven’t seen them since, hopefully they were able to get help. I feel bad when I see the children out in the street, I just hope the parents aren’t just using them as a prop to get more money.
2 – Proverbs 24:29 And don’t say, “Now I can pay them back for what they’ve done to me! I’ll get even with them!” I remember having this feeling a few times. One time wasn’t that long ago but I know it was in anger and once I calmed down and thought about it I knew it would be wrong to get revenge for something that in the big picture wasn’t really that important.
1) Yikes, this is a difficult one for me. I will be quick to admit that 9 times of of 10, I have been the one to give something if the panhandler asked, and I had some change or extra money in my pocket. Even more so, I have given money many times when I didn’t feel comfortable with the person I was giving it to. I seem to have more situations where I feel sorry for someone, especially when I can visibly see and injury or mental disability. Sometimes, It will be a normal looking person if they seem sincere, or seem like they need it.
ReplyDeleteI always tell them “I give this to you in Jesus’ name”, so they know where it is really coming from, and hope they don’t use it for wrong or destructive things. I usually have a good feeling in my heart when doing it, feeling like I am doing what the Lord has asked me to do. Nevertheless, I see your reasoning, and it is very troubling to see these situations play out like you mentioned in the post.
With all that being said, I have had many, many run-ins with Homeless people. From the Good - - - (Homeless guy walking down the street looks at me, double takes, and yells out loud “Take of your glasses superman! We need you out here!”)- - - To the bad - - - (Man swears at my grandma because she tells him I have no money). There is one specific panhandler that I have found it very hard to give to, and have not on several occasions. The young, able bodied man. There is just something wrong with the picture, and many times, I fear where the money I give will go. It takes a lot for someone like that to literally be in the streets, and legitimate hunger is not always on the top of that list. I had a situation like that today, and I chose not to give. Lets just keep it real when I say my wife and I didn’t see eye to eye on my decision…..
Nevertheless, it is ultimately something in which to be God-led, and not Man-led. Don’t make a decision about giving or not because someone else told you how to make it. This is something you need to pray about, and decide with a Clear Conscious before the Lord. I don’t think there isa wrong or right necessarily….just personal convictions.
2) The verse I chose from my readings was:
Proverbs 24:17 "Do not gloat when your enemy falls; when they stumble, do not let your heart rejoice,”
Once again…Ouch! It seems like this is such a slippery slope to find yourself in - - Constantly fighting this temptation, and finding that you keep sliding back down. In all honesty, it is so easy to do. To be happy when someone you don’t like, or you know doesn’t like you falls. When they make a mistake. When something bad happens to them. It doesn’t take much thought to be happy in these situations……but it also doesn’t make us different than any other sinner:
Luke 6:32 "If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them.”
RED LETTER ALERT! Words of Christ. Really need to take a heart-check in these situations, and draw near to God, that I might have His Heart, and not my wicked one. That’s why we as brothers need to strive so mightily to imitate the Perfect One, because He has given us an example and word by which to live our lives! Through His Holy Spirit, Holiness is attainable for those who seek it. Powerful word.
Well said William - "it is ultimately something in which to be God-led, and not Man-led"
Delete1. - I have helpful view toward the homeless people. Around two years ago I would give this homeless man my spare chance after work on my way home. For some reason he was always there on the intersection not too busy and he suddenly was gone. Two months ago he return. Again I gave him my spare chance and ask him where he had been. He’s respond that he was in Boston and I now back in Chicago. My light turned green and I did not have a changed to talk to him. I have not seem him since. I hope that next time I see him I will hand him a card and my spare change and that God would the rest.
ReplyDelete2. - Proverbs 24: 21 Fear the Lord and the king, my son, and do not join with rebellious officials, 22 for those two will send sudden destruction on them, and who knows what calamities they can bring?
Sorry I'm a few hours late but this is interesting because my daughters have helped at feeding the homeless with their mother and sometimes they ask why I didn't give that panhandler anything, my daughters have wonderful, caring and giving hearts but I will talk to them and explain a little about how the world is and really it's up to them to decide to make that decision or continue helping out. I give from time to time just because I feel driven to do it.
ReplyDelete2- Proverbs 24:29
Do not say, “I’ll do to them as they have done to me; I’ll pay them back for what they did. How often do we run around contemplating the fact that these words exist, I know I have, but revenge is not the answer to any feelings or emotions brewing inside of us.
Ephesians 4:14-15
Then we will no longer be infants, tossed back and forth by the waves, and blown here and there by every wind of teaching and by the cunning and craftiness of people in their deceitful scheming.
Instead, speaking the truth in love, we will grow to become in every respect the mature body of him who is the head, that is, Christ.
1: I came across this homeless man that was trying to sell me some stolen socks. I didn't want them but I still gave him a few dollars, he then tried to get a free soda from our restaurant.( that's were the this took place.) I told him he now has money to pay for it but he didn't want to. I thought he put it back but a customer told me he put it in his pocket. My wife and I went out after him and caught up with him across the street. When I confronted him about it he denied it, I went into his pocket that he was trying to avoid and there it was. I got heated and told him that he was lucky that my wife was telling me to last it go. If my wife wasn't there I know I would of done so much more than just get loud.
ReplyDelete2: psalms 24: 21-22 Fear the Lord and the king, my son,
and do not join with rebellious officials,
for those two will send sudden destruction on them,
and who knows what calamities they can bring
1. One time a guy was asking for money to get on the bus in front of Dominicks. I gave him 2 dollars. I come out of the store an hour later and the same guy asks the same thing to me not remembering me. I told him I just gave you money and he just looked stunned and didnt say anything. I think some times it is laziness, but I also think a great majority of the homeless have mental illness which makes it hard for them to work. I also think they probably werent raised correctly in how to interact with people while working and it can be hard for them to adjust with those types of situations. I'm not making excuses for them, but even though I didnt grow up in the best environment as a kid, its nothing compared to the people who grow up in the worst parts of the city. Little Village and Humboldt Park are some pretty rough areas, but its paradise compared to growing up in say what used to be Cabrini Green and or some of the other projects in the city. It really is a war zone in those areas and many people that live there have probably developed some type of post tramatic stress that never was treated.
ReplyDelete2. Do not gloat when your enemy falls; when they stumble, do not let your heart rejoice,
I need to take this to heart because many times I feel like I've been disrespected by certain people, and when those same people fall on their luck, it makes me feel like I want to say I told you so. But I know I shouldnt want anything bad to happen to anyone even my enemies. I pray to God that he lets me have forgiveness in my heart.